[OpenSIPS-Users] [OpenSIPS-Devel] Fwd: RTPproxy project

Bobby Smith bobby.smith at gmail.com
Sat Jun 14 15:17:45 CEST 2014

For us, transcoding support, being able to fork rtcp to a reporting server
(or even better, becoming an rtcp client), and (in a distant third) SRTP
termination would be the big features we're looking for.  We would love to
be able to do something around the nathelper API/rtpproxy API to offload to
a transcoder only when we need it, similar to OpenSIPS added sangoma
support, only with rtpproxy.  If the mechanism was added, we'd probably
contribute to some codec translation tables (remember, g711 and ilbc are
eerily similar in frame size).  FreeSWITCH does it by converting everything
down to a common binary format before transcode, which is how I'd envision
this would work.  Transcoding in software only is a huge value-add gain for
us, because it allows us to continue with a software only solution and
scale easier.

We engineer around losing an rtpproxy on the wire (which almost never
happens), with a few strategies around re-INVITE, silence packet detection,
etc.  It's not perfect, but it's well within the SLA we'd present our end
users and it's probably an area of the system where we get the least
complaints.  A dropped call every few weeks is beyond acceptable from the
generation that's used to going from 4 bars to 0 in a subway tunnel.

And rtp_cluster has been great for us, solely for the ability to tag an
instance as down and bleed sessions off of it before terminating it.  The
load balancing is on parity with the features added to the rtpproxy module
via opensips, with exception of this:  multiple opensips instances can talk
to the same rtp_cluster, meaning that you get a distributed session state
map can be highly available, instead of relying upon what's in memory with
opensips.  That's how we achieve the failover features that I think the
community want added.  Maybe adding rtpproxy session replication through
the binary data interface recently introduced to opensips could help with
some of this.

So yes, feature parity is important, but it's also important that we
maintain reliable performance.  I know Maxim has worked on some stuff
around threading that has helped us move forward to better reliability with
rtpp (separating command protocol from packet processing), so there's some
progress there.  The last time we did a comparison and made a decision
between the two major entities, we just found rtpproxy to be much better
performant at handling multiple sessions per instance, in the 50-60% better
range.  We can squeeze around 6000 established "sessions" (if you come from
an eSBC world) on an m3.xlarge ec2 instance and not break a sweat.

Ultimately, I think it's good for all of the community to show that a
project is in active development.  I think it's a win for both sides, and
discussions on where something is going are well warranted.

And this is coming from the SP with a capital V.

On Fri, Jun 13, 2014 at 1:55 PM, <ag at ag-projects.com> wrote:

> Guys,
> All these softwares are mature with many years in service both for the
> media relays and the SIP part. They deal find with most of the expected
> failures, which is what the customers expect. For the un-expected failures,
> well the sky if the limit for optimising with infinite cost/benefit ratio.
> I personally did not hear my customers asking for any more resilience or
> scalability for the media relay component, so I stopped optimising long
> time ago.
> A better question is where would OpenSIPS project go next, beyond
> optimisations, as the outside world does not stay still and the perception
> of some of my customers is that we are being left behind feature-wise.
> Adrian
> On 13 Jun 2014, at 14:18, Bogdan-Andrei Iancu <bogdan at opensips.org> wrote:
>  Hi Maxim,
> It is good to know about the rtp_cluster, but aside simplifying things, it
> does not bring any new functionality - the LB and failover between RTPproxy
> nodes can be done now in OpenSIPS module .
> The most challenging thing we are looking at is the ability to move calls
> between different instances of RTPP (for HA purposes)..or some restart
> persistence for the sessions - without something like that it's very hard
> to deal with SW/HW failures ; there are ways to go around for scheduled
> stops/restarts (maintenance), but non for unexpected failures.
> Thanks and Regards,
> Bogdan-Andrei Iancu
> OpenSIPS Founder and Developerhttp://www.opensips-solutions.com
> On 13.06.2014 00:36, Maxim Sobolev wrote:
>  Brett, on the HA/carrier-grade side there is little-advertized
> middle-layer component called "rtp_cluster", which in essence is
> load-balancing, transparent dispatcher that can be inserted in between some
> call-controlling component like OpenSIPS or Sippy B2BUA and bunch of RTPP
> instances running on the same or multiple nodes. From the point of view of
> that OpenSIPS it's just another RTPP instance.
> And it handles all logic necessary to load-balance incoming requests
> between online instances plus it can handle dynamic re-confiduration of the
> cluster and track individual nodes going up and down. The code is pretty
> usable, we have it deployed for several customers and it's being actively
> developed as well. We have it working reliably controlling up to 30-40 RTPP
> instances scattered over at least 5 nodes.
> http://sourceforge.net/p/sippy/sippy/ci/master/tree/rtp_cluster/
>  We have at least one pretty well known service provider whose name starts
> with capital V using it in combination with OpenSIPS to load balance RTP
> traffic via bunch of Amazon EC2 instances.
> On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 6:52 AM, Brett Nemeroff <brett at nemeroff.com>
> wrote:
>> Just wanted to add my 0.02 here..
>>  I totally agree with Bogdan. For the applications where opensips + a
>> RTP relay make sense, HA and persistence are much more important.
>>  WebRTC and ICE are kinda applications in of themselves. And although
>> these applications are going to grow in popularity, the "legacy" needs for
>> an RTP relay are still massively prevalent in the space. A general push
>> towards "Carrier Grade", resiliency and redundancy I think is much better
>> for the project as a whole.
>>  Not only that, consider that applications requiring ICE or WebRTC will
>> greatly benefit from HA / persistence, but not so much the other way around
>> :)
>>  YMMV
>>  -Brett
>> On Sun, May 25, 2014 at 6:30 AM, Bogdan-Andrei Iancu <bogdan at opensips.org
>> > wrote:
>>>  Hello,
>>> As always, the truth is in the middle.
>>> I agree RTPP is behind on certain things (and this is why we want to do
>>> them), but on the other hand it is a good platform with other good features
>>> (missing on the other relays). RTPP has better ability in individually
>>> controlling the stream (audio /video), ability to set timeouts and onhold
>>> with no conflicts, ability to generates events on timeout, more flexibility
>>> in handling symmetric / asymmetric NATs, ability to do media injection
>>> (playback), ability to do call recording
>>> What neither  mediaproxy, nor rtpengine have is a mechanism for
>>> implementing RTP failover (for ongoing calls) or restart persistence . This
>>> is something we want to look into. I would love to have ICE and WebRTC on
>>> my media relay, for the HA and persistence are more important I would say.
>>> Regards,
>>> Bogdan-Andrei Iancu
>>> OpenSIPS Founder and Developerhttp://www.opensips-solutions.com
>>>   On 24.05.2014 01 <24.05.2014%2001>:59, Muhammad Shahzad Shafi wrote:
>>>  To be honest, i have stopped using rtpproxy for over 2 years now. It
>>> is not evolving as fast as it should be, specially in the context of ICE
>>> and WebRTC technologies.
>>> I would like to suggest that opensips team should consider adding
>>> support for rtpengine from SIPWise,
>>> https://github.com/sipwise/rtpengine
>>> For now mediaproxy from AG Projects is the only good choice for handling
>>> media in opensips with ICE support (though it still lacks WebRTC features).
>>> Thank you.
>>> On 2014-05-23 14:55, Bogdan-Andrei Iancu wrote:
>>> Going for a public exposure on this question to Maxim, maybe we will get
>>> an answer here.
>>> -------- Original Message --------  Subject: RTPproxy project  Date: Mon,
>>> 14 Apr 2014 15:03:31 +0300  From: Bogdan-Andrei Iancu  To: Maxim Sobolev
>>> CC: Razvan Crainea
>>> Hello Maxim,
>>> Long time, no talks, but I hope everything is fine on your side.
>>> I'm reaching you in order to ask about your future plans in regards to
>>> the rtpproxy project? We see no much activity around it and other media
>>> relays are popping around.
>>> RTPP is an essential component for us, we invested a lot of work, we
>>> have many patches (extensions) for it (which we want to push to the
>>> public tree, but there is no answer on this) and we are also looking for
>>> investing a lot into big future plans (as adding more functionalities).
>>> Now, my question is - what is your commitment and disponibility for the
>>> RTPP project ? depending on that we what to re-position ourselves, as we
>>> do not want to waste time and work on things which are out of control.
>>> Best regards,
>>> --
>>> Bogdan-Andrei Iancu
>>> OpenSIPS Founder and Developerhttp://www.opensips-solutions.com
>>>   --
>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
>>> Muhammad Shahzad
>>> -----------------------------------
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> --
> Maksym Sobolyev
> Sippy Software, Inc.
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